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Discussion: (26 comments)

  1. One thing that may be beneficial is an “entry-level” wage, 30 days at $6.00/hr. The work habits and aptitude can be evaluated and a wage can be set after that.

    1. Charlieboy

      An entry-level wage would still make it harder for unskilled workers to get a job since the employer would still have to pay 6 dollars for 30 days, and that extra cost might not be worth it for them just to find out if a worker is worth keeping hired.

  2. Sub-minimum wage rates already are on the DOL books.

    1. Must young workers be paid the minimum wage?

      A minimum wage of $4.25 per hour applies to young workers under the age of 20 during their first 90 consecutive calendar days of employment with an employer, as long as their work does not displace other workers. After 90 consecutive days of employment or the employee reaches 20 years of age, whichever comes first, the employee must receive a minimum wage of $7.25 per hour effective July 24, 2009.

      Other programs that allow for payment of less than the full federal minimum wage apply to workers with disabilities, full-time students, and student-learners employed pursuant to sub-minimum wage certificates. These programs are not limited to the employment of young workers.

      1. Not TRUE in California!!!!!!

  3. raising the minimum wage isnt about preserving or creating jobs; it’s about reducing the deficit; it’s about paying people enough that they can pay their own way, pay taxes, and get off the SNAP & Medcaid rolls…

    1. Seattle Sam

      And it’s about pricing out of the market those whose labor value is below that wage rate.

    2. mesa econoguy

      Wrong, it is about increasing the deficit/government dependency by pricing out low wage workers, who will then be forced into government assistance, because 1) they are priced out of the labor market, and 2) there are fewer jobs available, because it already costs a ton to hire people.

      This is already happening, so let’s make the problem much, much worse.

    3. Otto Maddox

      So we’re going to transform small business into welfare agencies? What could possibly go wrong?

  4. Todd Mason

    The blogger’s point is ridiculous on its face. Is Alaska Airlines going to move to the airport down the street? Is McDonalds going to close its terminal restaurants and throw up a gigantic golden arches just over the town line?

    As in everything in life, employers’ decision to pay a minimum wage comes down to choices — compared to what? — and it’s not as clearcut as Seattle Sam believes, The jobless rate in Norway is 3.5 percent; in Germany, 5.2 percent; in Denmark, 6.8 percent; . Those countries are among those with the highest degree of unionization in the world. Consequently they have high wages for unskilled workers as well as working conditions that Americans would consider ridiculous.Try to find a store open on Sunday or after 9 p.m. Wal Mart pulled out of Germany.

    Shoppers in those countries pay high prices in addition to enduring inconvenience, But pay they do. Labor force participation rates are higher; unemployment is lower. Could it be because unskilled workers have money to spend?

    1. Monopoly situations can not be used to draw conclusions about non monopoly situations.
      Distortions are there, can you find them……

      1. Todd Mason

        Let’s impoverish a quarter of the population. :et’s also complain about growing social welfare costs and slow growth. A logical disconnect is there. Can you find it?

        1. mesa econoguy

          Turd, you blinkered leftists already have impoverished at least ¼ of the population via massive government labor laws and interference, outlawing of unpaid internships, and minimum wages, among other damaging “solutions.”

          Congratulations on discovering your mental disconnect.

          One of many, actually. But it’s a start.

          1. Todd Mason


            The top five in equality by comparing Gini scores for top decile and bottom decile, listed with 2012 unemployment rates (US = 8.1 percent) Iceland, 6 percent; Slovenia, 12 percent; Norway, 3.2 percent; Denmark, 6 percent; Czech Republic, 6.8 percent.

            So how exactly does higher wages for the bottom declle put people out of work?

          2. mesa econoguy

            It prices them out of the market, Turd.

            This is confirmed by terrible young worker LFPR, unemployment, and increasing income inequality, despite tax increases on “the rich” and recent minimum wage increases.

            You might want to re-read your WaPo piece again, specifically the part about high-earners retaining income (despite tax increases), but growing inequality in the US, more than Europe.

            Funny how your leftist redistribution policies have effects opposite of their intent…

          3. Todd Mason

            No one is being priced out of the market in Denmark, according to a biz columnist who landed there as temporary duty.

            $20/hour for McDonalds workers as enforced by unions, but much HIGHER labor force participation than the US, even by youth. I’ve heard Mesa’s argument for 40 years and then nothing happens. Businesses absorb some costs, raise prices where they can and life goes on, except that now the bottom decile has money to spend and less reason to go on the dole.
            Now I’ve suffered Big Mac sticker shock in Denmark so we might want to aim lower than $20 and phase it in.

          4. mesa econoguy


            Denmark GDP = $213.6 billion

            US GDP = $15.94 trillion

            Good luck with your ongoing Denmark comparison.

          5. mesa econoguy

            “Now I’ve suffered Big Mac sticker shock in Denmark…”

            You’ve just refuted your own bullshit there.

            How daft are ye, lad?

          6. Todd Mason

            The shock mostly comes from paying in dollars rather than krone. Happily the Economist has a Big Mac index meant to compare purchasing power across borders, As you can see here, Danes earning $20/hour for flipping burgers pay an effective $4.91 for a Big Mac. Not exactly the end of the world, eh Mesa?

    2. Is Alaska Airlines going to move to the airport down the street?“…

      No, if the numbers don’t add up to profit they’ll just pull out and give up that portion of the Seattle market…

      Is McDonalds going to close its terminal restaurants and throw up a gigantic golden arches just over the town line?“…

      They have before…

      1. mesa econoguy

        “Is Alaska Airlines going to move to the airport down the street?“

        In metro areas with multiple airports, carriers can and do switch to the other airport.

        So Turd’s witless snide remark is actually true in some locations.

        1. Todd Mason

          And particularly so for Alaska Air, which carries 50 percent of the traffic through Sea-Tac. It’s been my experience that businesses rarely practice self immolation.

          1. mesa econoguy
          2. Todd Mason

            So Spirit dumping Mesa for Phoenix Sky Harbor, a major hub airport, proves what about Alaska dumping Sea-Tac, also a major hub, for a secondary airport that doesn’t exist? OK it does mean we can add the airline industry to the long, long list of business topics Mesa doesn’t understand.

          3. mesa econoguy

            Correct. It also goes the other way, Turd.

    3. To all of you who will compare the U.S. economy to foreign economies. Norway, Germany and so on these countries bear little resemblance to the USA. We have a free market republic, These alternative countries will provide you with job for life but you will never grow or experience any more wealth than your socialist friend working next to you. There is opportunity here but with that comes risk, Just like life!

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